RNG in Evolution Gaming Wheel Games

[Slotspinner]

21 hours ago, terror_82 said:

Interesting. Where did get that info? I believe that only matches the thing that motor can make the spin look like as smooth as possible (RNG decided it to land certain number and it doesn't have to make huge breaking/boost whatever when host gave it a right speed).

I've played this game a lot as well. There are certain moments in the game you definitely see the motor keeps rolling the wheel on and on.

You've probably also seen these videos of infinitely rolling wheel without slowing down at all. Even though there wouldn't be any resistance of the flapper, it would slow down.

And yeah, there's no statement from @Evolution Gaming Officialthat is NOT motor, right?

I think i heard it from Kim who has talked to Evolution many times (regarding the screen telling the hosts what to do), and yes im pretty sure they deny any motors/brakes since the chat spams this conspiracy stuff all the time and the hosts tell them theres no such things

[terror_82]

23 minutes ago, Slotspinner said:

I think i heard it from Kim who has talked to Evolution many times (regarding the screen telling the hosts what to do), and yes im pretty sure they deny any motors/brakes since the chat spams this conspiracy stuff all the time and the hosts tell them theres no such things

That's still not proofing either that it doesn't have motor as you know. It's all random talks.

I remember in one session somebody asked if it's RNG and motorized and the host answered something like "everything in casino games is based on rng's".

[Slotspinner]

3 minutes ago, terror_82 said:

That's still not proofing either that it doesn't have motor as you know. It's all random talks.

I remember in one session somebody asked if it's RNG and motorized and the host answered something like "everything in casino games is based on rng's".

Proof is on the accuser. If you claim it has a motor its your job to prove it, until you dont it has no motor just like it works in Court

[RJ-]

 

On 13/01/2021 at 12:07, Slotspinner said:

Official statements are that its not motorized, so unless you have factual proof please also refrain from stating your (probably wrong) opinions as facts. @RJ-

Where can I find or read about these official statements?

[dirtystack]

On 13/01/2021 at 13:01, terror_82 said:

You've probably also seen these videos of infinitely rolling wheel without slowing down at all. Even though there wouldn't be any resistance of the flapper, it would slow down.

You watched it for an infinite amount of time with your tachometer out did you?

Those wheels will spin for ages as they are heavy and run on bearings if the flapper isn't directly slowing it.

How can you say it is an infinitely rolling wheel, wtf?

[dirtystack]

3 hours ago, terror_82 said:

I remember in one session somebody asked if it's RNG and motorized and the host answered something like "everything in casino games is based on rng's".

It is because everyone has the term RNG twisted up with the word random.

If I do something that is random, I will attribute it to RNG, but its not the result of a random number generator, it is just the result of randomness. Because we all play slots, which do indeed use RNG (random number generators), and watch streamers saying "RNG" all day - when we go to something like Roulette, which has no RNG (random number generator) we will still be saying we won/lost due to RNG. 

Live Blackjack is not based on RNG, it has no random number generator, the shuffle randomises the cards but it has nothing to do with RNG - but when we lose we think: RNG. 

live punto/baccarat, live roulette, these games are random but nothing to do with RNG.

The roulette wheel's outcome is not determined by a Random number generator, a roulette wheel IS a 0-36 Random number generator.

 

[dirtystack]

Unless, of course, life is a simulation.

[vanHooff]

Here is an official statement by Todd, Chief Product Officer at Evolution Gaming, responsible for the Monopoly Wheel game, about RNGs, starts at 37 seconds into the video.
 

Quote

Multiple RNGs that are physical, like dice and a wheel

p.s. usually I tend to stay out of threads about Covid, the Twin Towers and Revolution Gaming.
Just having some fun with Dirtystacks.

[terror_82]

2 hours ago, vanHooff said:

Here is an official statement by Todd, Chief Product Officer at Evolution Gaming, responsible for the Monopoly Wheel game, about RNGs, starts at 37 seconds into the video.
 

p.s. usually I tend to stay out of threads about Covid, the Twin Towers and Revolution Gaming.
Just having some fun with Dirtystacks.

Nice! Thanks for the video.

I may be stupid, but how should I understand that: Multiple RNGs that are physical, like dice and a wheel? 🙃

[dirtystack]

42 minutes ago, terror_82 said:

Nice! Thanks for the video.

I may be stupid, but how should I understand that: Multiple RNGs that are physical, like dice and a wheel? 🙃

Dice and wheels are random number generators of numbers within a specific range. They ARE random number generators, their outcome is not determined BY a random number generator.

I don't know if that makes sense to anyone else? A spin of roulette is the birth of a random number- there is no random number generator prior to that particular spin, unless you want to look at the entirety of history, all the way back to the big bang, prior to that spin as some kind of massively long winded, random number generator. Perhaps our universe was born because god rolled snake eyes.

They generate a random number via all the variables that going into the physical act of spinning, bouncing about, colliding, physics, temperature, resistance, etc etc.

The RNG that most people think of when talking about slots and gambling is an algorithm which generates a random number via software.

[terror_82]

10 minutes ago, dirtystack said:

Dice and wheels are random number generators of numbers within a specific range. They ARE random number generators, their outcome is not determined BY a random number generator.

They generate a random number via all the variables that going into the physical act of spinning, bouncing about, colliding, physics, temperature, resistance, etc etc.

The RNG that most people think of when talking about slots and gambling is an algorithm which generates a random number via software.

Yes, I know what is rng and how it's designed. I just haven't heard the term "physical rng".

I'm still skeptical. I'm playing this game a lot, and the wheel behaves really really weird. I was absolutely sure, that it's computer and rng based and I thought everybody else thinks that way too. Any more videos behind the scenes (behind the wheel!)?

[kenanth]

If you want to hit big, play when there are under 1500 people. Every big (99% of them) hit is in the morning time, a bit suspicious..

[dirtystack]

37 minutes ago, kenanth said:

If you want to hit big, play when there are under 1500 people. Every big (99% of them) hit is in the morning time, a bit suspicious..

All of them are in the morning, all of them are in the night, all of them are at midday- your statement is somewhat correct as it is always morning somewhere in the world.

Saying that 99% of them happen in the morning using your timezone, well, that is just pulling a number out of your ass, at best widely exaggerating, at worst; lying to make a point. 

Don't lie to make a point, it discredits you.

[vanHooff]

If you all don´t mind me derailing the thread from conspiracy theories to RNG´s, I offer you the following link:

Russians Engineer a Brilliant Slot Machine Cheat---And Casinos Have No Fix

A cool story about how Video Poker slots were emptied by a Russian Group by exploiting the pseudo-RNG of the machines.

Bonus story also about cheating/emptying Video Pokers, although not by exploiting the RNG:
Game King double up bug

[dirtystack]

Interesting read

The "casinos have no fix" part is a bit misleading though.

Technology evolves over time and when there is a threat to a system that system will be manually evolved, the machines with this versions of the software within these games would be updated and this method would cease to work.

Of course the same is true for those attempting to decipher the RNG, both parties force eachother to evolve and when one gets complacent the other profits over the odds.

The fact this is in the public, people within the casino security are identified as the source, shows they are confident this issue has been dealt with and is no longer possible.

There are certain groups of people who play in the casino, under quite specific scenarios, with positive EV. There are even some situations where the casino doesn't even really care, or do anything about it, as it actually adds to their overall income rather then detracting from it. 

 

 

[kenanth]

3 hours ago, dirtystack said:

All of them are in the morning, all of them are in the night, all of them are at midday- your statement is somewhat correct as it is always morning somewhere in the world.

Saying that 99% of them happen in the morning using your timezone, well, that is just pulling a number out of your ass, at best widely exaggerating, at worst; lying to make a point. 

Don't lie to make a point, it discredits you.

Europe, obviously where most of there players are from. Damn americans think everything is about them.

It makes sens that they would rig it to pay out big wins to less people, don't need to be genius to figure this one, but never know.
In addition, they always check a screen behind camera, to know when to release the wheel, this trick is used in Monopoly and Dreamcatcher as well.

[dirtystack]

44 minutes ago, kenanth said:

Europe, obviously where most of there players are from. Damn americans think everything is about them.

It makes sens that they would rig it to pay out big wins to less people, don't need to be genius to figure this one, but never know.
In addition, they always check a screen behind camera, to know when to release the wheel, this trick is used in Monopoly and Dreamcatcher as well.

Suddenly I'm American?  This kind of proves my point. You are lying about my nationality now in an attempt to convey that it means I am self absorbed and to discredit what I am saying, all because I dared contradicted you.

 You are lying about something that you are actually clueless about thinking that it wins you the argument.

Stop it.

Stop lying.

No-one will every take you seriously unless you have cold hard facts, not your opinion, not your exaggeration, a fair and balanced analysis. 

Not even worth the time.

[Stevej]

Played this last night again with other 6000 players for five hours or so. It was as dead as could be. No winnings.
 

And I wasn’t surprised at all today in the morning when I opened Tracksino I noticed 50x pachincho happened after these ”rush hours” for 600-700 players. Guys this is happening almost every day, and been happening as long as these games existed. 
 

For playing this game, it’s my own stupidity. I don’t blame Evo for my losses. I like the game and it’s far more entertaining than any of the slots. However it’s 100% controlled and that’s bit sad.

[RJ-]

I advice nobody to use Tracksino, it only works in the favor of Evolution Gaming and is probably their own site. They motivate people to join the game by highlighting the big wins

[ShrekTastic]

On 13/01/2021 at 11:28, terror_82 said:

I've always thought it's rng, cause it seemed so obvious to me and remembered their CEO saying like that in some interview. Maybe he meant the Crazy Time bonus wheel (the animated one). I'm still surprised people thinking it's mechanic wheel without any computer based RNG system. I wouldn't see that so negative thing even if it was like that.

However I'd still like to ask you

1) Don't you ever think it's bit weird that all these big wins happen in times of low amount of players? Haven't you ever questioned that thing? Crazy Time has about 5000 players in the evening sessions in European Time.

In one week frame three latest big wins: January 11 2021 at 03:46 UTC Cash Hunt 2500x (1136 winners), January 10 2021 at 03:44 UTC Cash Hunt 2500x (1018 winners), January 13 2021 at 07:43 UTC Cash Hunt 2000x (812 winners)... I know the list continues, unluckily we can't see rest of the results.

In one month frame the biggest win: January 6 2021 at 07:39 UTC Cash Hunt 12500x (573 winners)

2) Crazy Time is kind of a successor of Monopoly which used to pay quite good. But all the massive wins have disappeared after Crazy Time was released (about 7-8 months ago). Haven't you ever thought it's bit weird?

In one month frame the biggest win in Monopoly: January 12 2021 at 16:45 UTC 593X (1300 winners)

 

You are comparing winners vs amount of players. That's impossible. You don't know which player bet on what.

I don't want to get into these conspiracy theories, however I feel like when it was brand new and all streamers were promoting/playing the game, it hit the bonus rounds way more often. (Don't mean it in a offensive way against streamers, I know they wouldn't be playing it if it was rigged. ❤️)

[Slotspinner]

For the sake of all thats healthy minded, it is NOT rigged - look at the RTP of the game and see how much Money they make by default!

The wheel spins 24/7 and ive seen huge wins at any time of the day regardless of the players. Do you know what i had to witness while playing myself TWICE? x50 Crazy Time with being 1 spot off just barely not making it. TWICE!!

If i can get through to stay with the fact that its a real wheel and not rigged/motorized then so can you

[terror_82]

33 minutes ago, Slotspinner said:

For the sake of all thats healthy minded, it is NOT rigged - look at the RTP of the game and see how much Money they make by default!

The wheel spins 24/7 and ive seen huge wins at any time of the day regardless of the players. Do you know what i had to witness while playing myself TWICE? x50 Crazy Time with being 1 spot off just barely not making it. TWICE!!

If i can get through to stay with the fact that its a real wheel and not rigged/motorized then so can you

I never said it's rigged/illegal/whatever. I'm just saying it's motorized and the wheel landings is based on computer calculations and computer rng. It behaves unrealistic way. Everybody can see it.

[dirtystack]

If you set up a wheel at your house, streamed it and had viewers, allowed people to bet on the various segments, no tricks or anything.

Just wheel, no computer or anything - the outcome wasn't based on computer calculation or computer rng - guess what, there would be a thread titled:

Terror_82 RNG predetermined scam - don't play.

[terror_82]

5 minutes ago, dirtystack said:

If you set up a wheel at your house, streamed it and had viewers, allowed people to bet on the various segments, no tricks or anything.

Just wheel, no computer or anything - the outcome wasn't based on computer calculation or computer rng - guess what, there would be a thread titled:

Terror_82 RNG predetermined scam - don't play.

But I would also be fair and smart and before every session I would go through the wheel, show behind it and the room and answer people if they're asking how it works.

[Nelan]

@Slotspinner It‘s obv Not Crazy Time but if Monopoly is motorized would you say that CT is aswell?