The Macho Man
-
Posts
85 -
Joined
-
Last visited
Content Type
Profiles
Forums
Events
Posts posted by The Macho Man
-
-
And I was literally right about my 1 million a month prediction. Trainwrecks went on a podcast with H3H3 a couple days ago and said stake is paying him 1 million a month to stream and people believed it was impossible these streamers can get paid that much LOL. Like I said... a lot of you really know nothing about the industry.
-
1 minute ago, vanHooff said:
^^ From the Stake.com T&C's:
USA and the Netherlands excluded.
I suspect that the presence of these two countries in this clause comes from the Curacao license giver, not from the casino itself.
For the Netherlands: Curacao used to be a colony and still gets money ( 'loans' ) for which in return Dutch customers are not serviced.
USA: just not smart to mess with the USA when it comes to financial federal crimes.@The Macho Man I am not arguing about any of the posted amounts.
However I would no be surprised if Stake services Americans that it is shut down in some way so that the (5000) other casino's can operate like they are used to.Well the big loophole here is all of this is done with cryptocurrencies. So as far as I know its all a grey area which is why they get away with it. I don't think anything will happen with them until the US accepts that crypto is a currency. And the license givers are happy to hand out licenses to these sites until those loopholes are dealt with. Which is why I said its like the wild west. Crypto was a god send for some of these companies because it let them step over the line and take advantage of big markets like the US. That's why stake grew so fast.
My guess is when pressure starts showing up, Eddie the owner will just outright ban people from US and it will be like a traditional online casino with KYC and 'play at your own risk'. So I'm guessing for Eddie it's just a race to buy his way to the top and when that pressure comes he can afford to let go of the US market.
-
Also just another quick thing that can help shed light on just how much money stake is bringing in... I've attached an image that shows the recent weekly affiliate earnings for the past 7 days that they send out every week on the affiliate telegram group... $1.85 million PROFIT. paid out to affiliates the past week.
Now most affiliates on stake only get 10% of profit as their base payout. Some do get more, but those are mostly streamers and I don't think streamer affiliate income is accounted for in these stats (stake doesn't allow streamers to participate in other parts of community rewards and they usually have their own affiliate section), but lets just stick with the base 10% paid out to affiliates. Which means based on these numbers, stake made $18.5 million dollars this past week in profit... NOW that's just profit that is traceable to affiliates who referred people in, this doesn't even account for just regular signups that had no affiliate referrals tied to the account.
So just off these numbers alone, stake is making 50-75 million a month just on accounts tied to affiliate referrals. Now add in accounts with no referrals and streamers who's referrals may or may not be contributing to this number and stake is easily pulling in 50-75+ million a month profit, who knows what the total profit is after all expenses are paid for like paying out streamers/ambassadors/etc. The point is they are making a CRAP TON of money. And yet there are people here who still think they can't afford to pay streamers 100k a month LOL.
-
1
-
-
3 minutes ago, vanHooff said:
@The Macho Man Some of the bigger casino groups are publicly traded, and their annual reports can easily be googled and downloaded.
Moreover there are estimates for 'Channelization' which is the ratio of licensed vs unlicensed gambling, and also aggregate gambling tax numbers from governments are published.
Just as an example: 2020 marketing expenditure from Kindred Group (Unibet, 32RED et al.) was GBP 257,2 Million
Screenie from their annual report:
So yes, I tend to believe that Stake could spend EUR 12 million or so yearly on marketing through sponsoring streamers.
But I'd like to raise another point: the big casino's European casino's that are compliant with legislations all have responsible gaming in some sorts in their strategies or even their missions.
Admitted there are some shithole casino's that have Malta licenses (N1 Group) and some Curacao licensed casino's or sportsbooks are running a decent operation.
But otherwise, a Curacao license does warrant very little other than excluding Dutch and American customers ( DUCY? )
Some Curacao casino's might want to scam their customers and not pay winners, some don't care about KYC procedures or underaged gambling, some might want to make some money on the side using your KYC details, and some might be money laundering operations for organized crime.
Do you know anything about the ownership of Stake ? Do you mind?
I don't know much other than whats already out there. I know someone who knows the owner, the guy started the site maybe two/three years ago or so maybe. At first it was nothing more than a typical crypto casino site offering stuff like dice, and other basic games.
Then I believe it acquired some shady curacao license or 'piggy-backed' off one (don't know the correct term here). But it's been talked about on other platforms and articles that stake does use one of those shady licenses. Point is it was created by some guy a couple years ago as another generic crypto casino that was built up overtime to be more 'legit' and secured the ability to host real slots / table games.
Then the big crypto boom happened, obviously more people got into crypto, the guy did very well for himself, started paying influencers to play on his site and it snowballed recently in the past half year I'd say.
Now he has money to buy 'brand ambassadors' like UFC fighters and even bought an ad spot on the UFC mat for past PPV events.
But the overall point is this guy wasn't apart of any big casino company or I don't think he was funded in anyway, I think he may of got rich early off crypto and opened his own site and it blew up from there. But yeah crypto casinos work in a grey area in a lot of places. I don't think they have to deal with the same kind of regulations since most governments don't consider it a currency (At least thats their reasoning why they let people from US play). Although I think they are starting to crack down on this as some of the big US streamers are starting to move out of the states or gamble only when they visit places like mexico. (Big crackdown might be coming). And rumor has it the site itself is starting to crack down on US players, but I don't think they are, they are just trying to appear like they are cracking down.
But yeah I can see why the Euro people on this site think all of this sounds ridiculous and can't be possible because they see regulations everywhere for online casinos in their country. But crypto casinos are the wild west of online gambling, there are almost no regulations for it, and crypto in general is very anonymous to begin with so crypto casinos can get away with a lot more currently. That's why there's so much money in it and its growing so fast.
-
1
-
-
And to further drive home the point lets talk about the affiliate marketing side of things. There are casino affiliate programs out there that offer anywhere from $200-$300 + % of lifetime recurring income (based off play) to affiliate who promote casinos and get people to signup under their affiliate links and play.
Each casino calculates their average LVC (lifetime value of customer) in order to determine how much they are willing to pay an affiliate to generate signups to their website. If a casino is willing to pay 200-300$ for signups PLUS a % of the money made for a lifetime off a customer.... chances are the average value of each casino customer is worth easily over $500-1000 for offering deals like that.
Now take a guy like XQC... gets 150-200k views per stream. All his content on all platforms probably gets seen by a minimum of maybe 10 million unique people per month. (I'm pretty sure its a lot more than that, but for argument sake lets stick with 10 million unique viewers).
Lets play it safe and assume that out of those 10 million unique viewers watching his gambling content, he gets a minimum of 1% of those people to signup and gamble. Maybe since his viewers are a lot younger that the value of his LVC signups are on the low end of $500. That's still $50,000,000 in expected lifetime value of his signups. AND THAT'S LOW BALLING for almost all numbers used in this discussion.
So you're telling me a casino would never pay 1 million dollars a month for $50,000,000 in return? Yea... you guys have no idea how much money is in gambling.
-
1 hour ago, LetsTalkFacts said:
Not sure if you are serious or trolling, but do you really think that a casino will pay multiple millions a month to a streamer? Lmao 😂 let's say a that sketchy streamer has 3k (real) viewers most of them only watch for fun but let's say they all deposit 1000 a month (very unlikely) to the casino thats 3 million a month for the casino, why the hell would they share the half of it with the streamer?? All they do is bait new (underaged?) players.. It's like a pizza delivery boy (streamer) and a pizza company (casino), the streamer only brings players and they get a small tip for it while the casino getting the big money. Casinos are not stupid its all about the money they are SHARKS
They do pay millions to streamers, you know why? its the best marketing possible. they show live gameplay of the casino, they interact with their community and not everyone is a broke kid. all they need is a couple whales to make their money back. but they will still make their money back on people thet get addicted to gambling anyway.
You guys have no idea how the business works. Gambling advertising is already super strict as is and casinos look for any loopholes to try and get advertisements out there and this is the best way to do it. Stake was a no name crypto casino a year ago. now everyone knows about it...
Also you really think some streamer is going to 'sell out' and risk being called a scumbag for peddling gambling to their community for a couple thousand dollars in sponsorship money at their level? You guys have no idea how much money is involved in sponsorships and affiliate earnings (you think guys like roshtein would refuse to take subs and donations if they weren't making an insane amount of money from casino sponsorships already? Rosh could easily have 10-20k subs and probably make thousands a day off donations alone yet he doesn't even care to do so.)
Every time these discussions are brought up the main issue I notice is people's lack of understand of just how much money these casinos have and are willing to spend on advertising, branding, and other ways to generate interest in their casinos. ITS BIG MONEY. these websites can't just go advertise on google/facebook/instagram with traditional marketing because it's all banned. So their marketing budget is literally spent on influencers and it works.
-
1
-
-
2 hours ago, ressivv said:
Where the hell do you get this info from? 1 million in sponsors a month?
You act like these casinos are huge multinationals that can easily hand people 1 million or even 100k just to sponsor them. I dont believe this.
There are streamers with huge communities and websites/forums that are running well. They have also been around for much longer. This one for example and casinodaddy. These streamers should be making the same amount of money but they are still doing max 10,- spins on normal daily streams.
I dont believe that these 500,- a spin streamers with sometimes only a big twitch community (which could even be with fake followers) get this kind of sponsorship and can legit do these spins on regular basis.
there's just one example and the guy isn't even as massive as these other streamers you're talking about. more than likely guys like train and xqc get multiple millions per month.
-
13 hours ago, xLewis said:
when sites are literally offering you $35,000 every hour you stream for them you are going to take it i don't care who you are, even if it's immoral you are taking it and if you say you wouldn't stop lying to yourself lmao.
i do however think the casino section should be age gated on twitch (similar to youtube how you have to add a credit card or an id or something). but the fact of the matter is crypto is becoming more and more mainstream so i do think crypto casinos will become the new norm. people are getting paid out by these big reputable crypto casinos (i wont mention names dont want to be called out for advertising them) far quicker and far larger sums without all the stalling tactics used by the "normal" casinos.
This is a HUGE factor in why i play crypto casinos. its annoymous and instant deposits and withdrawals. No dicking around with verifications and some people here basically having to send in bank statements and prove they can afford to gamble etc its ridiculous. I understand why they have to do it in some countries but most casinos abuse that system in their favor to stall people from getting paid out. I'm honestly surprised crypto casinos aren't over taking the main online casinos right now.
-
you guys have to keep in mind that these casinos PAY A SHIT TON OF MONEY for sponsorships.
Mizkif a 20k viewer streamer said he was sponsored for 1 hour streams and was making $35,000 AN HOUR. And he said he thinks he was low balled too.
There are streamers out there that are easily making 100k+ a month minimum just from sponsorship money, some of the top guys easily clear 1 million a month off these crypto casinos in sponsorship money and that doesn't even include the affiliate money they get. Do I think it's ok? no... but nobody here seems to understand just how much money sponsored streamers get from these casinos. That's why 90% of the time its real money you are seeing being spent... These streamers are making a lot of money and can afford to up their bets (also when guys like train and xqc showed up they muddied the waters by doing 500-1000 bets per spin, now everyone feels like they have to do the same just to get those views).
-
typical hacksaw game. I love cubes 2 and chaos crew has been pretty well for me, but yea... the amount of dead bonuses in those games is insane. There's basically only 3 outcomes. 5x, 100x or 1000x+... 99% of the time its 5x
-
congrats!!!
I know this game has potential, just never thought I'd see anyone hit that potential HAHA
-
Nice win...
Hate these gems games by playngo though. Super volatile and are boring as all hell.
-
Just now, Mwright1712 said:
Did you not see Kim's video last week with the big win? One off a full screen of top symbol, paid very nice
I mean its the same as any book game, I just dont think you're going to see many max wins on this game vs one with a higher RTP.
There has to be a catch to this game. Like no provider wants to release real 99% RTP slots. that's like investing money into something and getting a 1% return when you could just invest your money into something else at 4% return. The game isnt fun or interesting enough to get enough people to play it to make up for that 3% loss either... So whats the catch? I'm guessing it just means the game is a grinder game where you sit there and collect books, get a bonus make some money rinse repeat no real profit potential unless you hit some lucky 1 out of 1 million bonus where you might get a max win. Vs playing something like book of dead which might have a better chance at max win at like 1 out of 100,000 but you have the possibility of ripping faster.
-
looks nice on paper, but ive never seen a big win on this game and its probably ultra rare. This might just end up being a wager slot.
-
5 bonuses on 1400 spins, that sounds amazing to be honest! I'm lucky if I get a bonus once every 500 spins.
Nah but legacy is such a trash game with RTP. I don't know if merlin came after but merlin feels like a more optimized version of legacy. The bonuses on merlin ALWAYS do better for me than legacy. Retriggers are basically a normal thing for me with merlin, but legacy? I'd be lucky to hit one retrigger in the bonus out of 20 bonuses. the retrigger rate in legacy is god awful compared to merlin.
Also if you have a bad bonus in either game, just get out and move on. Infact I don't even sit around and wait for another bonus. Both those games are hit and run once you get a bonus. Its almost like they are programmed to bonus once every 300 spins.
I love both of them at the end of the day because they can pay good when they feel like it, but if you don't hit a bonus within 100 spins just leave.
-
I played this game and the first one a couple times and I always thought there was some great potential there, but it just never pays beyond like 300x for me. same with cluster, most Elk games feel impossible to get over 500x on, but I will say I don't mind buying them too much because they tend to at least give you like 30-40x minimum back at worst.
-
I don't believe most new games have truly random spins anymore (like the code makes a call to some database that spits out a random spin). I think game providers instead do some shady shit where you load into good sessions or bad ones.., like no matter how many spins you make there are just some sessions where they won't give you a bonus and if you're lucky you load into a session that is predetermined to be a profitable one.
One way to see this in action is watching a degenerate streamer like trainwreckstv who can sit at a slot for hours on end without a single bonus.
I notice it a lot with playngo games. If you start a session on playngo and if you havent hit a bonus within 100-200 spins chances are you won't hit it. and even if you did somehow hit a bonus on like your 500th spin the bonus is always crap. However some sessions you can hit a bonus within 10 spins andt he game will just go on this profit spree up to a certain point then it will die again. Its like they program these predetermined blocks of sessions to better control the 'experience'.
Also a side note too about playngo. If you ever hit massive on one of their games, every other game you go to will be dry as fook until those winnings go back. I hear they have the most player tracking of any provider and I believe it. If you don't believe me go try it. Play playngo games, hit anything over 300x and then go jump around to more of their other games and I guarantee you won't bonus or win on anything until you practically give that money back and more.
-
9 hours ago, The Reel Story said:
You're misinterpreting 'pre-determined' here. The result is still random and is still determined by the RNG, but the whole bonus result is generated at the point you click the spin button, rather than spin by spin within the bonus. It makes no difference which way you do it in terms of the result and the RTP.
Think of it like this. If I roll a dice in front of you 5 times, you will see 5 random numbers one after the other. If I roll 5 dice behind a sheet, and then take away the sheet to show you all 5 at once, you will see 5 random numbers all at the same time. The end result is you still see 5 random numbers.
but technically aren't those 5 hidden rolls not random since all that matters here is a predetermined return outcome?
like lets say each dice roll is a multiplier, if its predetermined when you hit spin and lets say your win is 10x. wouldnt the rolls of 6, 1,1,1,1 be predetermined if thats how it played out and its not really random.
whereas with the BTG, if each spin is truly random you don't know your overall outcome yet until the last spin?
-
on a side note would you guys rather have predetermined bonuses or leave it up to RNG like BTG?
Part of me kind of prefers the predetermined bonuses, but at the same time it just feels like a 'rigged' way slot providers can control the RTP easier by giving a lot of crappy bonuses vs rare good ones. Whereas the random bonuses anything can happen, but at the same time most of those bonuses will probably be crap anyway if it truly is random and the bonus ends up being a slight 'edge' vs just base game spins.
-
6 hours ago, casio said:
Tell me one thing, there is Evo who are the game provider and also the company that physically made the game.
If it was "Rigged" or manipulated what happens if 1 single person for either of those 2 companies:
- Leaves the company on bad terms
- Goes to a competitor
- Leaves the company for any reason
dont you think by now we would of heard about this from SOMEBODY?
not that I believe its rigged, but ill play some extreme devils advocate here.
These people are based out of latvia. A pretty poor country...
They deal with a crap ton of money. The regulations on this stuff? who enforces it? I don't know the details when it comes to that stuff but what if someone found it was rigged, what happens then? they tell the rest of the gambling world and maybe some of the more 'legit' sites and countries ban it? What if that person who is supposed to regulate it is in on it?
What if some schmuck from latvia and this 'regulatory' agency who probably get paid $10 an hour, are paid off? what if they get their own kick backs to give the greenlight to this entire operation?
if history is any indicator, gambling is one of most corrupt industries ever. These guys make so much money and are doing this operation out of... Latvia... maybe that's for a reason.
When big money is involved corruption is at it's highest. One thing I noticed that is a side note to all this is the interesting 'players' who sometimes randomly join sessions betting large amount of money on certain numbers for X amount of rounds and then leave, they always seem to show up when a bunch of big number multipliers show up. It's also kind of weird how a lot of these names are in russian.
You ever see a host start acting funny when someone starts talking in russian or has a russian name? It's almost like they get worried. I wouldn't be surprised if there's some high level Russian gang / government money laundering going on with that game. These guys come in for 20 rounds, bet tens of thousands, collect the money, leave and then the game goes back to normal.
either way at the end of the day I don't think the wheel itself is rigged, but they can rig everything else about it.
-
Anyone play this yet?
oh boy what a stinker. where's the potential at?
Maybe if the prize drops were multipliers instead of just + whatever then it might be interesting.
-
1
-
-
Ive said this before in another thread and ill stand by it. Crazytime is definitely controlled, but the RTP is controlled not necessarily the wheel itself.
if you pay attention the payouts and when they happen you can see a pattern.
My guess is they definitely try and keep the RTP round the 94% or whatever they say it is on a weekly basis.
Some days on crazytime it won't hit anything (yesterday was a good example, they didn't have a crazytime bonus in over 300 spins). Yesterday was really dry.
Today looks dry too. They are currently 'farming' for a big RTP payout, which usually comes on the weekends from what i noticed (more eyes on a big bonus so it gets more people excited).
Once the RTP hits a certain point maybe like 80% throughout the week, then crazytime is primed to 'pay' and one of those big multipliers will hit and squirts out a 3-5million dollar win that shoots the RTP back up and the process repeats itself.
They say themselves that crazytime is a slot machine. The only real random thing about it is the wheel spinning, but the top slot can calculate where the wheel will land and decides to give a big payout or not.
-
57 minutes ago, The Reel Story said:
Not quite true. Most games are on a rev share model, so the casino gets 80% ish, the platform gets 12% ish and the game provider gets 8% ish of the monthly profits.
That said, I expect they would just exclude the play of sponsored players when doing their profit calculations, so in this instance I would guess that you're right and the casino is only 'losing' their 25% of cash outs.
Think your numbers might be backwards. I dont think casinos get 80% id say they probably get like 5-15% the game provider getting the majority of the profit. hence why the providers pay all the jackpots and big wins.
-
On 14/05/2021 at 14:42, BoudewijnB said:
Roobet only loses money when he cashes out. Before then, no matter the game he plays, Roobet just gets the money back. Many people make the mistake that they think the slot or provider gets the money but in reality they are already paid for and it’s just the casino that has the cashflow of money
what???
doesnt make any sense.
Gates of olympus over 16000 spins with double chance bet without bonus
in Casinos & Sports
Posted
Things like this are why I don't think online slots are truly random. I think the game providers break everything down via sessions and track your winnings.
When you 'log in' to a game I think it pulls up info on your past winnings with that provider and decides if it wants to give you a winning session or not and bases everything around that. Because I've had big wins on games and then no matter what other games I play they will all be dog water and not payout anything until any previous winnings get 'paid back'.
I'm on this kind of streak right now with playngo. Last month I did very well on them, this month, every bonus has paid under 20x and that's if I can even land a bonus within 500 spins.